[Team Building] Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

Discussion in 'Archived Guides' started by windkeeper4, Aug 23, 2013.

  1. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    Please Note: I am working to finish this guide as fast as I can. Please withold any commentary until the end of the guide or if you feel I have explained something in error please PM me and I will fix it (and credit you).

    Change Log:
    1.2 - Added healer subs/specialized subs.
    1.1 - Posted healer team summary and list of leaders/alternative leaders.


    Why a Healer Team guide?

    There is a lot of information/questions regarding Healer Teams in general. Hopefully this can serve as a concise analysis of various Healer team setups, leaders and subs; along with providing builds and suggestions to give players a start when tackling dungeon strategies.

    Why a Healer Team

    I don't know about you but I loved Sailor Moon growing up. I think my devotion to the Healer team build probably arises from some trauma involving my memories of Sailor warriors doing battle. That aside Healer teams are pretty damn cool. Fragile, deadly and cool.

    Pros:
    • Healer teams are spike damage teams. They can either be 9x Rose Valk/Rose Valk or 10.5 Rose Valk/Metatron
    • They have wonderful RCV values. If you do not die from being hit and you can match three heart orbs along with another combo or two there is a very good chance you'll be healed to full.
    • Due to their ability to either be mostly mono-color or rainbow they can accomodate a variety of different dungeon situations.

    Cons:
    • They are very squishy. Extremely squishy. Chances are if a descend boss smacks you there's a very good chance you're going to be seeing the continue screen.
    • The key players of a Healer team, Valkyrie and Metatron, are farmable under very hard conditions and only available from the rare egg machine, respectively. Without these the core parts that make up a healer team don't exist.
     
  2. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Main Leaders

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    Warrior Rose Valkyrie/Princess Valkyrie/Great Valkyrie/Valkyrie

    Valkyrie in all her forms, most especially in her ultimate form, used the single key component that made or broke a Healer team. The introduction of Metatron provides Healers teams with an alternate lead- however Valkyrie is obtainable from her own descend dungeon wheareas Metatron is not. Valkyrie is also still a fairly important sub on a Metatron team.

    Valkyrie's active ability gives healer teams a nice way to get rid of heart orbs. Wheares other teams might have issues healing after being hit a Healer's team problem is going to be surviving the hit. Healing afterwards is never a problem- assuming you're still alive. At 5 turns max skilled the ability becomes something you can pop off multiple times across a dungeon run. More importantly Valkyrie's leader skill turns the delicate (and deadly!) healer group into a spike damage monster able to blast its way through even the mosty thorny opposition.

    All the praise aside at max level her total health is only 2308 (before +eggs) but she boosts a staggering 656 RCV. The diligent Healer team user should prioritize feeding Valkyrie +HP and +ATK eggs to maximizie her usability.

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    Voice of God, Metatron/Archangel Metatron

    Metatron is an interesting Healer team lead. It's HP value at max level is only 2354 a few points higher than Valks. Their ATK values are also remarkably close 1189 for Valk vs. 1280 for Metatron. However Metatron's RCV blows Valk out of the water 863 vs 656 for Valk. This is because Metatron's leader ability is only active while you are at 100% health.

    That ability however is again slightly better than Valks multiplying your ATK by 3.5x vs 3x for Valk. Which means if you run a Metatron/Metatron team you can deal 12.25x spike damage or 10.5x if you run Metatron/Valk. It's active ability recovers 6x your RCV per 11 turns (before max skill) which means that if you are hit and fall below 100% health there is some leeway to healing up and being able to spike damage again. Even if you decide to go Metatron/Metatron for your leaders you are still going to need a Valkyrie sub for her ability to turn heart orbs into light orbs.

    Valkyrie vs Metatron

    There is a lot of debate as to whether or not 10.5x/12.25x conditional damage is better than 9x sustained damage. I would point you to look at those long threads if you wish to edify yourself. Personally I prefer the sustained 9x damage of a double Valk team. Alternatively players might want to try the 10.5x Valk/Metatron team to give them an idea if they can quickly overpower groups of enemies before taking damage. The Valk/Metatron setup allows players the leeway of still retaining 3x damage from their Valk leader should they take some form of damage.

    Specialized Team Leaders

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    Demon Viper Orochi/Viper Orochi

    Orochi is an interesting alternative leader. If using him you are essentially creating a more advanced version of a zombie team than a spike damage team. Orochi's leader ability often comes in useful in boss dungeons and descend dungeons where there are not multiple hits. Regardless of health a healer team has the ability to heal to full quite easily. Orochi also provides another possible delay in the form of its active skill. Orochi can be a useful leader for the older descend dungeons or for newer healer teams wishing to feel a dungeon out. Ultimately zombie teams are risky and fragile. It is better to adopt the philosophy of kill before you're hit.

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    Blue Wind Ninja Hatsume/Hatsume no Tsubone

    Hatsume presents an interesting team lead. Her ability is 1.5x ATK, HP, and RCV. This gives you a combination of 1.5 HP, 1.5 RCV, and 4.5 ATK. Her active ability, to turn dark orbs into water orbs, is also slightly useful as most healer teams do not typically run with a dark sub. Unfortunately there are not that many good Water healers and the only one that is a constant on most healing teams (Siren) has a fairly dismal ATK value. 1.5HP is also fairly pointless with the already low HP values most healer teams run with. Hatsume, like Orochi, is a rare team leader at best.

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    Freyja, the Fertility Goddess/Freyja the Goddess of Gaia/Freyja

    Freyja is another interesting lead that is slightly more useful than Hatsume and Orochi. Her leader ability is 2x ATK and RCV. Running her with a Valk lead nets you 6x ATK with 2x RCV. However Freyja truly shines when it comes to her active skill which increases Wood attacks by 1.5x for 2 turns. Putting her as a lead (or as a sub) gives you another option through which you can boost your spike damage for those pesky hard to kill bosses. Though she is a god Freyja's HP, ATK, and RCV values are only slightly better than Valkyrie and depending on your teams composition her Wood Attack boost might only affect her and the Valks you are running a fairly specific payoff which pay not be worth it in the long run.
     
  3. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Commonly Used Healer Subs

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    Siren, the Enchanter/Siren/Mermaid

    The ever dependable Siren plays a somewhat vital role within the healer team structure. Her easily maxed ability to alter fire orbs into heart orbs provides healer teams the nescessary ammunition for a relatively stable supply of light orbs via Valk's active ability. However Siren suffers from dissmal HP and ATK even at max level. While the other commonly used healer subs are at least somewhat able to hold their ground when attaching with their own elements Siren unfortunately cannot. While it is possible to run a healer team without her by using CoC Glorious Healer or Parvati as subs for an heart orb provider, her ease of attainment and easily max skilled ability keeps Siren in the running for a viable healer team sub.

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    Echidna the Red Empress/Echidna/Naga

    Echidna is another vital part of healer team composition. Echidna's active ability is most often used either at the end boss or a sub-boss to delay an attack that would otherwise decimate the fragile HP base of the healer team. While Echidna's ability is welcome the player must also be aware that her delay acts as a life counter- there is a very good chance that if the boss is still alive by the time Echidna's delay has worn off your healer team is about to bite the dust. Echidna suffers from the bane of all healers, subpar HP. Her ATK is nothing stellar but it is leagues better than Sirens. Discerning players should note that any +eggs spent on Echidna are not nescessarily going to waste as she is also a relatively vital component to several other teams while her leader ability makes farming low level dungeons a relative breeze.

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    King Shynee

    It should be noted that while King Shynee is a healer type, its previous incarnations Shynee/Big Shynee are not. Do not get the two confused. Like the other healer type reviewed before King Shynee has low HP and ATK and furthermore only goes up to level 50 versus the max level of 99 of most other monsters. However King Shynee is an invaluable part of the healer team setup for its active ability which increases all Healer Attacks by 3x. Should your King Shynee be active when confronting a boss there is a good chance your attack will either outright destroy the boss or at least take out a relatively large chunk of their life.

    You should always run with a King Shynee in your healer party. While its active skill is relatively hard to skill up, if you do manage to max skill it at a max level of 12 it becomes especially useful in certain descend dungeons. The ability to triple your healer's attack more than once in a single descend dungeon should not be overlooked.

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    Love Deity Cosmo Venus

    Venus is an interesting sub. At max level she has a very decent amount of health in comparison to the other healers and attacks twice since she has a sub element along with her main element. Her active ability let's you "freeze" time for 10 seconds which can sometimes be invaluable in setting up combos to unleash your barely contained healer fury. In short Venus is a very good stat stick to boost a variety of the healer teams downsides. Everything is not roses however as her active ability is fairly hard to max skill which means you can realistically only use it once per dungeon. Unlike the other subs covered above Venus is only obtainable through the rare egg machine.

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    Fertility Deity Holy Ceres

    Like Venus Ceres is essentially a state stick. However unlike Venus her active ability is relatively useless on a healer team. She has a slightly better spread of stats in comparison to Venus and also comes with a sub element to give her a double edged attack. When in combination with a Freyja lead Ceres becomes the better choice over Venus. Without the Freyja lead she is mediocre compared to Venus unless facing a dungeon with a strong weakness to Wood based attacks in which case she becomes relatively equal in usefulness. Like Venus Ceres is only obtainable through the rare egg machine.

    Other/Specialized Healer Subs

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    Hatsume

    Hatsume can also play an advantageous role as a sub within a healer team. Her ability is especially useful since most healer teams find themselves with a general abundance of dark orbs and no way to convert them into something useful. As a sub Hatsume is generally low to mid average though her ability pushes her to average depending on the dungeon composition. Players will either want to sub her in when fighting a dungeon where there is a marked increase in Fire opponenets or a marked increase in Dark orbs to fully utulize her abilities.

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    CoC Glorious Healer

    A limited time collab monster for those who have obtained the CoC Glorious Healer results have been generally mixed. Her active ability, turning all dark orbs into light orbs, coupled with the fact that she a light monster creates a healer team sub that lets you play a fairly strong Light heavy healer team with a splash of color. Unfortunately the CoC Healer has one painfully glaring problem. Her max level is only 50 giving her a measly 1008 HP and 688 ATK. While her on use ability is a great payoff and is not all too painful to max skill one should carefully consider whether the hit to the healer team's already low HP is worth the effort.

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    Valkyrie

    Valyrie can also play the role of a a sub within the healer team. While this is common in a Metatron/Metatron setup, where Valk is used for her ability to supply light orbs, it is also relatively common in a Valk/Valk setup. Valkryies on use ability, her dual attack due to her sub element, and her above average stat distribution, for healers, makes her an average to above average addition as a healer team sub. Players who have more than one Valkyrie are encouraged to use her as chaining multiple heart to light activations over the course of a single delay can in many cases wipe out a boss.

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    Flame Mech Warrior Jotunn/Wood Mech Warrior Asgard/Water Mech Warrior Midgard

    The golem series, while not healers, can sometimes be a useful addition to the healer team to simply boost HP levels near an amount where they can survive attacks. With max HP values of 5074, 5088, 5107 before +eggs for Fire, Earth and Water, and their active skill with reduces all damage by 50% for 3 turns the golems are nothing to sneeze at. When considering whether to weather an attack or blaze through players should estimate whether the additional health the golems provide, along with their protection, will allow them to achieve that narrow margin toward victory.

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    Susanoo no Mikoto

    Unlike the golem line Suanoo only maxes out at 2770 HP, however his active ability reduces all damage taken by 50% for 5 vs the 3 turns provided by the golems. In some cases having a 5 turn 50% reduction can be a life saver compared to a static value of HP- though again this is largely dependant on the dungeon you are encountering. Susanoo unfortunately has the distinction of only being available from the rare egg machine while the golems are, fortunately, farmable.


    Monsters Specific to Japan

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    Mitsuki, the Flame Fox/Ruka, Lady of the Sea/Kano, Daughter of Nature/Fuu, Dancer in the Grass/Kurone, the Feline of the Night

    Should you have had the luck to be playing in Japan and obtained one of the sticker healer girls, congratulations, I hate you. Available through a limited time promotion in Japan the sticker girls carry the interesting leader ability of being able to increase the HP of all healers by 2.5x. Assuming you have a sticker girl and feel the need to healer tank a dungeon then you should do so and then take screenshots for lols. As subs the the girls carry the active ability to turn all orbs of their opposing element and all light orbs into heart orbs. Given that ability the only realistically useful sticker girl to employ would be Ruka, Lady of the Sea as her ability instead converts all Fire and Dark orbs into heart orbs. Think of her as an ungraded Siren with the downside of having an active skill on a 10 turn cooldown.

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    Time Mage

    If through your dark witchery you obtained a Time Mage congratulations you now have the ability to field an almost entirely light based healer team. Once again available only in Japan, the Time Mage is a low powered Naga delaying enemies for only 2 turns but on a 9 turn cooldown. Unlike Naga it boasts a nice chunk of 2333 HP and 1215 ATK. Users who have the Time Mage can effectively substitute him for Naga gaining a shorter delay but a bit more HP and ATK in the process. Siren's ability is now no longer a tradeoff between getting hearts or having a nonexistent Naga attack. Also it is very cute. It is a rabbit/dog and it is wearing a hat. A. Hat.

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    Ultimate Puppetmaster/Ultimate Puppetmaster Santa

    Like Venus lite these cute fellows let you move orbs around freely for 7 seconds. Boasting a nice 2465 HP (only 10 HP lower than Venus) and an ATK value relatively close as well they are decent Venus substitutes for people who have them and not Venus. That said they are once again only available in Japan from the same collab dungeons that produced the Time Mage.

    Rarely Used Subs

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    Lilith, Witch of the Night/Lilith/Succubus

    Lilith is an interesting sub since in her final form she is both Healer and Devil. She also happens to be the only Dark based decent healer obtainable in the US. Unfortunately her active ability does not lend itself to spike damage. There is a good chance that if you're poisoning an enemy its going to end up killing you before your poison has a chance to really work. As subs go Lilith is slighty more useful on a Devil team than a healer team.

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    Archangel/Angel/Cupid

    Technically the Light's main healer she is nonetheless attrocious. At max level measly 1243 HP and 789 ATK don't lend themselves to active and adventure. Her final values are only a tiny bit greater than the CoC Healer we covered previously- but considering Archangle goes up to a max of 99 that's just a shame.

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    Alraune/Mandrake/Drayd
    Alraune has the unfortunate distinction of being placed in the same boat as Archangel. She's just plain horrible. If you're considering using her as a sub - don't. Go field a golem instead.
     
  4. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved for general team compositions and relative pro/con in composition
     
  5. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved for general Healer team setups for descend dungeons/trick teams
     
  6. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved for farming/dungeon location of useful healer team drops
     
  7. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved
     
  8. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved
     
  9. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved
     
  10. windkeeper4

    windkeeper4 New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Reserved
     
  11. eltoshen

    eltoshen moobs and bussy

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    This looks great! Can't wait to see the rest of it. :)
     
  12. MisterDrgn

    MisterDrgn You can't take the sky from me. Staff Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Cool stuff. I'm gonna go ahead and move this to Tips & Tricks. If it gets sufficiently polished, we might sticky this in the Guides section. But I'm not sure--we're running low on space, so there's definitely value in combining multiple team types into a single guide, like eltoshen was working on (http://puzzleanddragonsforum.com/showthread.php?tid=15168).
     
  13. Jchunksgt

    Jchunksgt nOOb

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Meta + Meta should be added to this.
    I've been messing around w it and my lvl40 + a lvl 61 friend is blowing stuff up.
    I'm not saying it is the best, just saying it should not be ignored.
     
  14. s4dfish

    s4dfish New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Brand new to healer teams, just got my Valk this last event and pulled a Metatron last night. So much XP to go...
     
  15. shugaoyua

    shugaoyua Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Gungho, make angelion's ulti a healer type so the crapton of fairlions in our boxes aren't completly useless!
     
  16. Matthias

    Matthias New Member

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    RE: Healer Team Appreciation, An Exposition

    Nicely done! I was just looking for something like this : )
     
  17. sunglassesmichael

    sunglassesmichael Ruka button is OP

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    JP version had a sticker girl event in August where there was a Pink REM dragon that pulled only sticker girls. Did you get any since you wrote that bit about wanting some? I got Mitsuki & Ruka.
     
  18. bangbang

    bangbang Light Mage

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    A lot of us try to max out light spike damage in an iteration of our healer team. I've been using a team of Valk Valk leads with a Bench of Venus, Shynee, Raph, Unicorn situationally. If what separates me from beating a dungeon with my healer team is how hard I can spike on the boss, this is the best response I can come up with. This has been discussed a bit on the monolight thread. Perhaps some damage calculations are in store for this thread?

    Let's assume that team is max level with no plus eggs. The four healer monsters will have a base light attack of 4423 (including Venus' extra 10%). If we do Ralph --> Valk --> Unicorn --> Shynee skills then, the 30 orb match is equivalent to a 7.75 multiplier (1+(30-3)*0.25=7.75) and the Unicorn enhancement is 2.8 multiplier (1+0.06*30=2.8).
    4423*3(valk1 leader skill)*3(valk2 leaders kill)*3(shynee active skill)*7.75(30 orbs)*2.8(Unicorn active skill) = 2,591,436 damage. The non healer monsters add another 55,269 for a total of 2,646,705.
    This is under the conservative estimate that no matches occurred on the orb reset. If we got lucky and got, say 3 off color sets matched, the damage would be over 4.5 million. Add a million damage for each light match that falls.

    If you get two shots at the boss, then using the other Valk's skill and Venus will serve nicely. Very possible to deal another half million damage here.

    If you had 2 metatron leads, replaced bench venus with a valk, you could conceivably deal over 6 million damage in one shot before any luck based sky matches.

    Conversely, if the board has a lot of light and heal orbs when you reach the boss. Valk --> Unicorn --> Shynee --> Venus could frequently deal even more damage than Raph. If you find yourself having success with Venus' skill, drop Raphael and add another Valk or CoC healer to the team.

    In time we'll see Athena descend, who could replace unicorn. Venus could be replaced by another Valk. With some skill and proper orb changers, you can reasonably deal more damage by a strong light combo than using raphael's skill (Venus would help here), making Raphael not vital. You just lose the sure 2.6 million damage aspect. If we ever see time mage, that might be a good choice for this team. CoC healer would be reasonable replacement for Raphael as well to use in tandem with Valk's skill. So the farmable team would have a bench of Shynee, Athena, Valk, CoC healer (Unicorn is farmable... but I feel for those who didn't see him after a quadrillion attempts).

    Note, other members of this forum came up with this team idea (I would name names, but I'd feel bad for leaving out the input of others). I just use it. I also use a rainbow healer team for standard farming. This spike team's biggest challenge is often delaying for Raph's skill to be ready (an ugly 23 turns). If you dump Raph and use Venus for the big combo, it's a 20 turn delay (JP collabs have a skill up creature, so that could be dropped to 15 some day). Shynee is a 17 turn delay, and while it is conceivable to make a bunch of King shynee's to skill up him, (min 12 turns) that would be a ton of Gold Dragon kings burned in the process (which would likely set back the leveling of the rest of your team). Unicorn has a 15 turn delay. I think only the truest gluttons for pain have skilled him up at all.
     
  19. bangbang

    bangbang Light Mage

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    Thanks windkeeper for making this thread. I'd debated it before, but kept realizing I wouldn't put in the proper work.

    Let me make one suggestion for the first page of a thread: Post healer team guides for specific limited time dungeons (team composition, when to use which skills, etc.). This is probably written for a bit more advanced players then when the monochromatic threads were written. (The US just was just lower level as a whole then). Perhaps spill less digital ink on broad strokes and more on how to accomplish specific objectives.

    Cheers
     
  20. MisterDrgn

    MisterDrgn You can't take the sky from me. Staff Member

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    bangbang makes a great point. Monsters like Raphael, Unicorn, and Athena (who isn't out in EN yet) are not healers, but they make potent subs on a healer team. They really should be included in the guide.

    Also, I think CoC Healer should get more credit. The ability to get her is limited, and she's harder to skill-up than Siren (although easy when Poring Tower is running). But I think she is objectively better, which is why I've replaced Siren with CoC Healer on my team roster.

    Advantages:
    1) Light attack is *much* more valuable than blue attack, since you'll be turning so many orbs light, and potentially enhancing them. Also, of course, light damage can't be resisted.

    2) Getting rid of dark orbs is better than getting rid of red orbs that Echidna could have used. This is less important.

    3) Less exp required to max her level.

    Disadvantages:
    1) Less hp. 223 less hp at max level.

    2) Less attack. But who cares! Light attack is better.

    3) Less RCV. But you've got plenty of RCV.


    So the question is, is it worth giving up 223 hp for a more potent monster. I think it is, but others may disagree.
     

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