Sumire and Friends vs. PaD (Alrescha, Uvo Blonia)

Discussion in 'Archived Guides' started by Grizztof, Sep 1, 2015.

  1. icebarrier

    icebarrier ~(=w=)~

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    i think i got the jist of it based on undone's post, padherder became a struggle when there's too many things to keep track of

    like this right?
    [​IMG]
    forgot her rcv is kinda meh

    one thing im confused about is her lead skill, does it only need 1 of the 5 orbs to be enhanced
     
  2. Shinigami Yuki

    Shinigami Yuki Things are getting hectic.

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    Yes, only 1 but you want that guaranteed drop so you can always activate it
     
  3. Herobyte

    Herobyte Notice me Kanna

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    Is it okay to run sumire,U&Y,dark hermes x3 (when he comes out)

    The row output would be amazing with some tpas to snipe some weak guys. 4 out of 5 oe though wich should be enough

    Also when max skilled its easy to dish out damage for a final burst and when u need shield and damage u pop both leads

    Heres all my water subs-http://i.imgur.com/qmQlPdL.jpg
     
  4. Grizztof

    Grizztof Shirley, you can't be serious.

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    100% enhanced blue skyfalls is kind of a big deal.

    You can mix and match where your damage comes from for Sumire. My team has 6 TPAS, 6 rows, and 7 orb enhances. 3 TPA burst is about 5.x million w/o skyfalls, but would probably break 6 million reliably if I forgot rows and ran U&Y instead of Berry. Rowed bicolor 24/6 to 26/4 boards are easily over 6 million w/o skyfalls. TPAs are way nicer for mini bursts. Running both lets you still hit hard with TPA/5match/Row sorts. If you wanna just focus on +orbs, that can be an easy 6 million, too, but you have to be serious about stacking them. My test team hitting (about 400 total +eggs) had 13 orb enhance awakes, with #RollForAwilda hitting like a truck. You just need to find ways to build a team with stats, cooldowns, awakenings, and burst board generating options you can live with.

    [​IMG]

    I've looked for sparkleboard options to skip using an OE active, but the awakenings aren't there. I keep eyeing Gabriel's "afterthought" heart enhance because it's serious business coupled with a heartbreak, especially Herme's double heartbreak. Just make sure there are four red orbs on board.

    There are so many ways for me to build this team. It's why I've been really unfocused plussing my subs. I finally started focusin on Valk (got her 60 eggs since that team pic) because she's my sub that breaks 1.5 million the most. It's not fun to see 1.4 million vs fatty and realize +eggs would have made the difference.
     
  5. mlskid

    mlskid Member

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    So what exactly is the strategy behind this type of team? Is it just to consistently burst through each floor, or is there use to strategizing stalls until you can have actives. The reason I ask is because with a team of half sumire, half Hermes max skilled... You can orb change every turn, plus have insane row damage from the 9 rows every turn. I know that's not exactly a very practical team though, was just curious what the most practical team composition would be.
     
  6. Herobyte

    Herobyte Notice me Kanna

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    I was mostly looking at the row damage of the team with the hermes, and unlike bodin who have more rows, hermes can make more blue orbs.

    U can easily swap a hermes for a heart maker, but this team is made out of the limited amout of blue subs I do have. I was just wondering if a team like that would work.
     
  7. FXStrato

    FXStrato Neonine

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    Daaannnggg. After reading this guide, I really want to pick up a Sumire now... I have so many water subs that would jump at this.
     
  8. Grizztof

    Grizztof Shirley, you can't be serious.

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    Unlike My first two endgame leads, Apocalypse and Set, Sumire can go in so many directions. Depending on what you've rolled, you can leverage defense, offense, haste, TPAs, rows, OE, slime vs. orb enhance burst, HP, etc with Sumire. Apoc pretty much had to go rows before Kanna, and probably still has to. Set has like, 1-3 subs for each subelement and cries at binds/poison without exact REM rolls. He also has a dearth of time extend for a team that needs to sort complicated boards for max burst. Unfortunately, unlike Apocalypse and Set, she HP/RCV tanks with a heart cross only, so Sumire as a tank team is only as good as your last turn and doesn't carry into a premptive, so a "shield" lead still needs a "shield" sub for some preemptives.
     
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  9. mlskid

    mlskid Member

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    Does her cross damage reduction work on preemptives? I heard that they didn't on release from somewhere.
     
  10. Grizztof

    Grizztof Shirley, you can't be serious.

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    No. It doesn't work. I'd loved to see that "fixed".
     
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  11. undone1

    undone1 Member

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    To be fair possibly her best sub is summer awilda so the shield needs are sort of covered.

    The one thing I like about sumire is that as a non IAP (I am considering 1 pack of 85 to get me off the ground largely on box space but will probably not) it literally doesnt matter what blue monsters I have as long as I have 5 orb enhances I can run sumire.

    In terms of strength I think the following types of sumire team designs

    1) The true system, Sumire A Karin, Sumirex2, Summer Awilda, Sumire friend Possibly sub out 1 A karin for neptune dragon if you manage to get your hands on it.

    2) The Row team with minimum 9 rows this is either double odin or neptune dragon and awilda for orb enhances. With less than ~9 rows I think it's less damage than the OE team assuming all orbs are enhanced. Better with board changers.

    3) The OE Team with 13+ OE's. This team is stupid. I mean that literally if you can match 5 orbs this provides crazy consistent damage. Downsides are sometimes you lack heart orbs without REM subs. Best sub is also andromeda for skyfall orbs which is REM only.

    A TPA team exists but its mostly the OE team with TPA's sprinkeled in VIA More of the JP ult evo'ed nut.

    I'm mostly theory crafting based on numbers I looked up but the system team is absolutely disgusting for sumire since you effectively become a 20.25 attack 57~% Damage reduction static team making you almost on par with A Lakshmi damage wise and in terms of damage you absorb 57% makes you even more of a tank than her. If any thing about this is wrong feel free to mention it. I'm still new and just theory crafting so take it with a grain of salt.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2015
  12. Grizztof

    Grizztof Shirley, you can't be serious.

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    I am the progenitor or #RollForAwilda. The shield may be covered once we get 5 cooldown. 7 turns is too long for a1 turn reduction.

    I think Sumire, if the team is +egged and skilled, is tremendously non-IAP friendly. Zhou Yu. Berry Dragon. BL Siegfried. Good stuff.

    I totally think Sumire trashes Lakshmi, and I'm sad Lak isn't a better Sumire sub.

    Row Sumire works.
    TPA Sumire works.
    OE Sumire works.
    Tank Sumire works.
    I can't be sure if full-offense Sumire works.
     
  13. Herobyte

    Herobyte Notice me Kanna

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    I guess ill test out the full offense one after d/b hermes comes out
     
  14. FXStrato

    FXStrato Neonine

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    In terms of full optimal damage output, would it be better to run row or OE? Debating between those two partly due to sub pool. Awilda would probably have to be a permanent member on an OE team due to her amazing awakenings; would the rest be fill in orb changers, or dupes of Sumire?
    For row, I can see a Hermes, Blodin, Andro, and perhaps some other orb changers to ensure you have enough orbs to make rows.

    Can anyone draw up some sample teams? If I roll a Sumire in the next godfest, I'm going to start making a team. :3
     
  15. brouxhaha

    brouxhaha Dream Killer

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    I don't think Awilda is a lock to make every team, unless you are going strictly oea. I don't have her and it really only hurts for preemptives. The team I felt most comfortable with so far was: Sumire/Nut/Hermes/Andromeda/Skuld

    It's quite a mishmash team, but it was effective. If I hadn't messed up and only gotten a 4-match (on what I thought was a 5-match) on Hera-Is in TEC, I likely would have beaten it.

    I think these subs, in general, are probably all better than Awilda: Gabriel, Andromeda, Hermes, Skuld, BUrd, Karin, Starling, U&Y, Nut, BValk. I wish I had Gabriel to go with BValk.
     
  16. FXStrato

    FXStrato Neonine

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    Seemed like your team had a lot of everything, haha. I just like to focus on one aspect of damage dealing, and it seems to me like the easiest for me would be to either have an overload of OE so just matching 5 orbs will do a lot of damage, or to have rows, as I have a lot of experience in making those thanks to a Ronia lead. I guess with enough orb changers in the team, one wouldn't really have any problems activating the LS when needed.

    Is the Gabriel +B Valk combo supposedly that strong, out of curiosity?
     
  17. Morbetto

    Morbetto Troll Coordinator

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    Just need to say: I ran split with a Blodin lead (my blue leads blow because I refuse to feed Lakshmi) and Sumire is freaking AMAZING.

    She even gets her own little graphics.
     
  18. brouxhaha

    brouxhaha Dream Killer

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    Gabriel changes light -> blue; dark -> heart, then enhances hearts. Use BValk to break hearts and almost all blue orbs will be enhanced.
     
  19. undone1

    undone1 Member

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    To be honest the optimal team is likely something silly expensive like Neptune dragon x2 + Awilda + Anything with 2+ Rows. At least in terms of burst. In terms of consistency nothing will beat a system team with 2-3 sumires and either A karin or awilda. If you dont need the shield 6 sumire or 5 sumire 1 A karin tops anything for consistency.

    If you're looking for more general than specific I feel OE is best if you have androm for skyfall or hera is for enhance board after a board change. This provides exceptional burst when comboing all skills.

    TPA's are best if you are healing and stalling because you can store up 9 water orbs.

    Rows are extremely REM heavy so I cant say too much on em but math I did says these are the best at either 8 or 9+. I don't like this because it's not as reliable but the spike is higher, especially if you make 2 rows.

    As to subs better than awilda to be honest the JP Ult evo nut is the only monster I'd be happy to have over awilda. It's only 1 OE less but has TPA's, and a much better active.
     
  20. Grizztof

    Grizztof Shirley, you can't be serious.

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    Gabriel + Bvalk/Siegfried is a geat way to avoid wanting an OE active.

    I've been trying EEC. Chinese floor is my best yet with Sumire. (I think I can get it with 4 hypers or less)
     

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