[WIP Guide I guess] 7x6 crosses shenanigans with Ult Karin Kanzuki from Street Fighter collab

Discussion in 'P&D Discussion' started by YamaKyu, Feb 17, 2019.

  1. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Yes ! She was actually kinda the MVP of February C10 because for Beorc I needed to clear the awoken binds and I had Sakura Matou (5 turns of awoken bind clear) instead of Odindra, but coupled with NY Yomi they did the trick.
     
  2. Tetedeiench

    Tetedeiench Active Member

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    She's so fun to play. Changing from the regular 7c playstyle to just explode things is so much fun.

    Like one-shotting poor bigfoot in the current quests despite his 95% shield, and damage capping every card :D

    My team is composed of : Karin / NY Yomi / Christmas Ilmina / Amen / R. Indra / Kenshin with glavenus equip, rathios equip, enoch, saria inherited in the team.

    I plan to make my second karin an equip and inherit her on Karin. I feel getting a cloud resist is more important than a second karin instead of kenshin, which is MVP with his short, skyfall active that ensures 3 full rounds of damage.

    There are some pulls you regret at first but prove invaluable. I was sad at getting NY yomi at first, boy was i wrong. And now, i'm so happy to have Karin !
     
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  3. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Glad you like her ! Have fun with your obliteration machine !

    Speaking of obliterating.
    Today I had my first natural 4 cross board without active skill. Which means that Karin Kanzuki CAN damage cap on a natural board. Without a single active skill.



    :hilarious:

    On another topic, I'm looking into Shinrabansho collab and there are a couple cards nice to have for Karin. I will make a post about that soonish.
     
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  4. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Ok, so, Shinrabansho collab !

    There are a couple cards among 5* pulls that might be useful to Karin, mostly as options. In that I mean you can use them if you need to but they're not really key subs (unlike cards such as Xmas Ilmina, Rin or Hexazeon or whatnot), so it's ok if you don't have them.

    Here are the cards you might be interested in :

    [​IMG]
    • En.
      He's arguably quite off-color since he only has light sub-attribute, but he does bring ok HP to the team, 3 fingers, guard break (only situationally useful though since Karin can easily break armors with sheer power) and he can be bind immune. But most importantly he's the fastest RCV debuff eraser : even with her x2 RCV LS, Karin can get into trouble if she eats a RCV debuff (especially if you don't pair with Evo Karin herself) because with so few HP you always want to be at full in harder challenges, so RCV debuff can be critical if you also have to deal with poison typically.
    [​IMG]

    • San (skill assist only)
      Obviously don't sub her.
      I just wanted to point out that she has a precious 5 turns 30% shield, for anyone out there without a Susano like me, it's nice long shield option on a surprisingly short cooldown : when Light Bastet hit NA, if you get 2 you can cycle Enoch and San active skill (inherited on Bastet that is) to have permanent 30% shield and that is a pretty big deal when Light Bastet herself is a nice Karin sub.

    [​IMG]

    • Ruby
      With her double SB, double fingers, bind immunity, a team HP awakening (that Karin wants) and ideal attributes, Ruby is totally suited to be a Karin sub. But since she's a 5* pull you can't expect her to have too much HP, especially as she also happens to be a healer, so her 5k HP is kinda mediocre/ok-ish in Karin's standard.
      What makes her an option to consider is her awoken skill bind clear. If you run a fully bind immune team (which you should), it might be ok to only have an awoken bind clearer, and nothing to address regular bind (some dungeon will gladly prove this wrong though by having spawns that awoken binds then binds you :9).
      However tbh fail to see a situation where you would want her instead of Odindra. Still. She exist.

    [​IMG]

    • Hakuren
      She only has a single finger, but ironically she's very likely Karin's best option/sub in this collab, and the only one that is worth being a main sub : despite the fact she's a 5* pull, she does have 6k HP. However, her main features that might make her a good sub overall are:
      → her active skill that guarantees 2 crosses and breaks defense so that you can kill annoying armor floors like Noah with only this active skill.
      → her double poison and jammer resistance. Poison resistance isn't too much of a deal for Karin since she has so much RCV (especially when paired with herself), but bombs are straight up bad for crosses, so I highly recommend trying to resist them. Hakuren is a rare sub that can do that. This shouldn't be overlooked.

    [​IMG]

    • Kanan
      Second best Karin sub in this collab, after Hakuren I think. Her HP might be mediocre at only 5k, but she does have a bunch of features going for her to compensate :
      → With her double team HP awakening, she actually virtually has 5.5k HP, and significantly increases the team HP.
      → She's a RCV stick. Now, you would think that you might not want need one (especially if you pair evo Karin with herself), but she can help with RCV debuffs if you're affected by one or heavy poison boards, because as healer herself she brings massive RCV per heart-TPA with heart triple heart enhanced awakening.
      → She's an incredibly fast 5 turns awoken bind/regular bind clearer, because she has a no-skyfall close tied to it, which also helps a lot against spawns that need damage control, because, you know, 7x6 skyfalls....

      Too bad you have to chose between the super finger and cloud resist SA, as both are great to have.

    (I'll add them all to the main post)
    (card info from the amazing pad.protic.site)

    In the end I wouldn't recommend pulling Shinrabansho specifically for Karin subs, however if this collab has something else (like Athena Another or Kaede Another) that you want, well be aware that all your 5* pulls might not all be worthless !

    Remember, these are options before anything else. There are better subs overall, but sometimes you need something specific, and Shinranbansho collab might have it.
    Also I might be used to play crosses and all, my opinion just can't be all valid and absolute, feel free to disagree with me and add the discussion !

    If you found it interesting, I can keep doing these kinds of post for future collabs to come maybe ?

    EDIT : I made a big update to the main post.
    → Some descriptions have changed
    → Changed the general layout to make everything easier to read, and get easier access to the information that you're looking for
    → Added the Shinrabansho collab cards
    → Added some more other cards and inherits to the list, especially cards from FMA collab
    → Fixed some typos
    → Also changed the title :9
    → Some other stuff I already forgot about ~

    Next to be added are probably Halloween Myne and Sakura Matou but I'm done for today :9

    EDIT : I also need to review the Yu Yu Hakusho cards. I looked into SAO and didn't find anything really useful. Alsos spoiler : Yusuke is a very nice VDP option.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2019
  5. Tetedeiench

    Tetedeiench Active Member

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    @YamaKyu I want to make my second Karin into an equip, but I need a Karin best friend, and you seem my best option :)

    I found your I'd, I sent you an invite. I'll bf you right after. If you need a particular equip on her, tell me, I've got lots of options ! I'm planning to equip her with her own equip.

    I'm just wondering which latents to use on her. HP++ ? Time extends ++ ?

    ID : 371 112 380
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
  6. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Added you o/
    I don't want to force you to use an equip you don't want, but if you're willing to try it, maybe consider Rathios equip instead ; I've slapped myself a Karin equip onto my Karin to address cloud resist because all my Karin friends have Rathios equip (which is great). Ofc that is only if you want to, I ain't pushing anythings onto you when I can swap my inherits myself ha ha o/

    I've been wondering about that as well for a while and just added my thoughts yesterday to the big post. Since I'm lazy I'll just quote myself :9
    I don't think there's a straight best solution or anything of the sort, so I just went with SDR + rainbow resist since I think it'll be useful someday. If you have a better idea, feel free to share it :>
     
  7. Tetedeiench

    Tetedeiench Active Member

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    Sorry for missing this part, best friend :)

    I've put a rathios equip on my Karin. I just need to finish max-skilling Enoch (He's in the march quests with a x3 skillup rate), and i'll be running training arena to level her up (she's 103) along with a few subs.
     
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  8. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Another big update to the main post today !

    → I made a proper changelog that at the very top of the post so that you can see if you've missed anything.
    → For all subs I added my recommendations for super awakenings. Feel free to disagree with me !
    → Added a bunch of non-REM subs : Athena-Helios, Jorm-Ullr, Sleipnir, Sakura Matou, Myne and Xiu Min

    Next time I'll actually review Yu Yu Hakusho collab. It's enough for today x)

    No worries ! It would have been hard to catch it anyway since I didn't make a proper changelog yet (there is one now !). And thanks for BFing :> And good luck with your leveling !
     
  9. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Finally cleared Arena4 today for the first time ! It took me a bunch of tries though ~
     
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  10. Tetedeiench

    Tetedeiench Active Member

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    Nice ! You are at least two leagues above myself in making crosses.

    I've settled on my go-to team :
    Karin (rathios)/NY yomi (Enoch)/ Christmas floof(Saria)/ Amen(glavenus)/Alphonse(rathios)/Karin(Karin)

    Amen can be replaced by zinogre if I need fujin.

    It is a blast to play - it clears training arena real fast, even if I die sometimes to the dreaded "Jesus cross" (that felt weird to type). It's basically a "keep all actives until the Tama floors and use them all to burn the remaining enemies" strategy. What got me once was underestimating the number of crosses needed to break defenses.

    I still need practice to reliably hit 7 combos with a double-cross. That has a lot to do with placing the crosses and having a 3 match fall after each cross disappear - player skill issue here, clearly.

    I have hexazeon, but he's unskilled, and I don't see myself farming him 50 times just for Karin. I don't think he's worth it.

    The main power of this team is fun. It made doing old dungeons so much more bearable than going in with old stale dmeta...
     
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  11. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Looks really solid ! What you're missing would arguably be an answer to long awoken bind since Karin looses a lot of HP when she's awoken bound, other than that it looks like you're sitting on a very nice team.
    Good luck on your way to practice comboing !
    Hexazeon is just really really good but not mandatory, especially when you have so much shielding (Rathios x2 and Enoch, maybe Alphonse for a stronger shield) so you can totally do without him.


    On my end, my team is still a WIP actually, but I'm very close to V1. I'll post here when I'm satisfied with it ~
    Though it won't be V1 before Hexazeon receives his new set of awakenings ; it'll allow me to go from 80% blind/jammer resist to 100% ~
     
  12. Tetedeiench

    Tetedeiench Active Member

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    I'm ignoring hazard resists for now - they haven't been a real issue.

    I just noticed that kuwabara from yu yu hakusho, in its latest evolution, will be a great, great assist for training area. He voids defense by 100% and makes two column of light orbs that are not stuck to the sides at 11CD.

    Running him on a low CD sub like amen can make life easier by not using actives for predras and such - without a defense break you need 3 crosses to kill them.

    Running him flat is not that bad either : 5kish HP and 1.5s orb move time with SA. Not great, but not bad.

    It's niche, I'll let you decide if he's worth mentioning :)
     
  13. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Someone on reddit just reached 7 crosses with Karin Kanzuki today.

    SEVEN CROSSES.

    WITH KARIN KANZUKI.

    :hilarious::hilarious::hilarious:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/PuzzleAndDragons/comments/b1iv2t/in_response_to_3mil_with_kanzaki/
    I'm genuinely disappointed the damage cap is so low because gosh did I want to see these numbers skyrocket into outer space.

    I think new Kuwabara might actually be the MVP of this collab (for Karin that is), or maybe ex-aequo with Yusuke and Sensui ! Only thing wrong with Kuwabara honestly would be that you have to choose between bind immunity and super TE. Everything else in his set, and especially the combination of its great extremely rare AS and his VDP makes him an inherently very nice sub.

    Yusuke cards should be reviewed and added to the post like tonight or tomorrow !
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019 at 3:19 PM
  14. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    ALRIGHT !
    Yu Yu Hakusho cards !

    While it was originally not too suited to play crosses when it first came out, Yu Yu Hakusho collab's come back brings some very nice options that you can use as full fledged subs for your Karin team. In particular, Yu Yu Hakusho collab is notable for having by itself 3 great VDP options very suited to be used in a Karin team.
    Very quick note on Suzuki (purchasable card in MP Shop) : I wouldn't recommend buying him for Karin, his added value is overall quite limited as it doesn't do anything about Karin's inherent flaws, and his contribution to pushing the team forward is quite low.


    [​IMG]

    • Yusuke Urameshi (light/light split ult)
      With this new split ult, Yusuke joins Xmas Ilmina, vanilla Ilmina and Edward in the "rare subs that can VDP" club. He might not be the best (it's Xmas Ilmina), but he's great at this. Split Yusuke has nice set of awakenings in general but the notable thing is his double VDP. You might think it's unnecessary to have 2 VDP with a lead as powerful as Karin Kanzuki, and wouldn't be totally wrong, but not so right either. If (and only if) there is a single offensive awakening Karin Kanzuki 1/ wants 2/ can use multiple of, that is Void-Damage Piercer. Reason for this is simple : VDPing a spawn limits the number of crosses you can match to 3. And a Karin Kanzuki team will hardly have more than one VDP sub (you can, I just wouldn't recommend it (unless it's 4 Xmas Ilmina maybe xD) since all Karin VDP subs only bring offensive value), so you want that card to carry the kill.
      Though, I'm not sure we have yet a Void Damage spawn that can resist a one shot from a sub when 3 crosses where matched (genuinely wondering, I mean 3 crosses is at the very least 300M+ damage per subs at 3 crosses (and easily over 500M)). Which means double VDP being actually relevant is an edge case.
      The number one thing that is "wrong" with split Yusuke is his only OK HP (at 5.9k when lvl110+297). Other than that he's totally suited to be a Karin sub : +1.5secs of matching time, bind immunity and a board fixer that makes 12 light (in 7x6 that is), so either a VDP or 2 crosses if you manage to move them. His HP<50% awakening is also arguably wasted for Karin since you always want to be at max/high health.
      • RECOMMENDED SUPER AWAKENING : Super time extend.

    [​IMG]

    • Shinobu Sensui.
      Arguably the MVP of this collab for Karin, or almost. Probably ex-aequo with Kuwabara (see below). Tbh there's nothing Sensui does wrong ; he has good HP, double SB and fingers, bind immunity, and the very nice combination of a precious VDP coupled with a rare 10c (which needs skyfall or a combo+ AS to be activated VDPing though).
      What really makes him stand out though is his active skill : the combination of a quad-color board change (which is quite rare actually) and a very strong 75% shield makes it a great AS to have either directly as a sub or inherited on someone. It's the kind of active skills that really shines in higher challenges where preemptives can be extremely savage such as higher arenas.
      • RECOMMENDED SUPER AWAKENING : Armor break if (and only if) you can build rainbow. Armor break is great as it allows you to clear floors with high armor low HP by only using a minimal amount of the orbs you need, which is great when you're playing a orb-hungry playstyle such as crosses. If not, 7c brings consistent offensive value and VDP will get you this extra damage to secure kills. Pick whichever suits you the most.

    [​IMG]

    • Kazuma Kuwabara (light/light split)
      Kuwabara is a great candidate for MVP of this collab tbh.
      He's a very nice Karin sub in general and brings good value. His HP is quite nice at almost 6.5k, he's yet another YYH VDP sub (half of Karin's VDP subs come from YYH ha ha) and can also address L-unlock (though it's a shame his sub-attribute is light because you don't want to match light Ls). Building rainbow isn't an easy task, but if you can achieve it Kuwabara's value is further increased by the guard break awakening. However his double OE awakenings are just wasted and you can feel they put it here just to fill the awakening set and make it reach 9 (I wish they would have slapped some resist or Team stats+ awakenings instead tho).
      What makes him shine is -again- his active skill. It's pretty unique not only because it voids defense entirely, but because it makes 2 columns of light (2 crosses) that aren't stuck to the sides of the board : this positioning allows for extremely fast cross matching. That in itself is pretty rare, but combined with the def break it makes this active skill a great "hit two birds with one stone".
      • RECOMMENDED SUPER AWAKENING : It really is a shame you have to choose between bind immunity and super finger, tbh. If you're already sitting on a comfortable amount of matching time go for bind immunity, else a super time extend is always welcome in a Karin team, and bind immunity could be addressed with a weapon if necessary (super luxury though).
    I highly recommend to try to get at least one Puu, as Karin absolutely can make good use of a card that doubles her matching time and brings a 75% shield, alongside increasing the team's HP by 500. Excellent equip evo.


    I'll add all of that to the main post soonish !

    EDIT :
    I updated the main post
    → Added YYH cards
    → Added Yuna from Final Fantasy
    → Formatting update, with a new "added value" part for each sub so it's easy to know what makes a sub an interesting without having to read the whole thing
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019 at 4:07 PM
  15. YamaKyu

    YamaKyu Crosses are "desirable" again with Karin Kanzuki ♥

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    Dragonbound Dragoncaller collab is here !

    If you didn't pulled a Rathios from the previous iterations of this collab, you might maybe want to try to get one as he's arguably the single best equip evo for Karin !
    On a side note, I took a quick look at DBDC collab and I was about to rant about the lack of Karin subs in it, but actually there is one :

    [​IMG]

    • Valeria
      • ADDED VALUE : Big HP and team HP+, guard break
      • Valeria is a heck of a HP stick. She's only that, but she does it at full throttle. With her combination of 8k HP (lvl110+297) and 4 team HP+ awakenings she'll push your team HP to new highs : that's a total of 8 team HP+ when playing Karin X Karin. That's a big x1.4 HP, almost the same as base Karin's LS ! With so much of these awakenings Valeria herself virtually has more than 11k HP, and if you have a Hexazeon in the team it would be like he had 18k+ HP. You should have no trouble reaching 60k+ HP if you have Valeria and a bunch of HP subs in the team.
        Unfortunately this massive HP boost is the only real value she brings to the team, as none of her SA or awakenings are notably interesting for Karin, and her AS is only situationaly useful. With something like a shield AS she would have been borderline a key sub, but as is I can only recommend her if you're desperate for HP.
        • RECOMMENDED SUPER AWAKENING : Guard break if you can build rainbow, else 7c.

    I'll add her to the list right away !
     

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